Looking through the various arable and machinery topics in the FWI forum it appears that min-till, lo-till, mulch-till or whatever you want to call it comes up time and again. Either it is a subject of great interest or min-tillers are a load of saddo's with nothing better to do than look at FWI! I suspect it is the former!! In this new 'environmental' age in which we are living should we perhaps be calling min-till, lo-till or whatever, CONSERVATION TILLAGE. It would sound better and perhaps be more 'saleable' to the public and politicians alike if we are going to have a go at getting some modulation cash back. Would there be any merit or use for a UK Conservation Tillage Association? I have visited conferences and meetings in Canada and the US of Conservation Tillage associations (or clubs) and it is the way in which many farmers gain info on the subject.I also attended the inaugral meeting of just such an organisation in France just before Christmas - over 500 farmers attended. The French are looking to set up independant on farm trials to evaluate various no-till systems and products.

Good idea Jim, I think by having one name instead of 5 or 6 the public is going to find it easier to learnt about. Then from the main name there would be the different levels - perhaps a numbering system e.g Direct drilling = 1 right through to one pass systems = 4 and then fit everything else inbetween such as the scratch approach etc. I still think the best initial step forward is to get something on line. My very basic step is in the form of a web site http://www.eco-till.co.uk but its not finished by a long way as I am waiting for results such as plant counts to post. Also if Tom does this article he mentioned that would be another step in the right direction - dont you think?

Tis done - look in FW Arable 1 March p54 or follow these links: http://www.fwi.co.uk/article.asp?con=1525&sec=2&hier=66 http://www.fwi.co.uk/article.asp?con=1499&sec=2&hier=66 Personally I'm against conservation tillage as a term. I'm always limited by how many words I can squeeze on to a page, so would rather say min till, thanks. But an association could be a good idea. I'll mention it to the Crops team & see what they think.

Yes Jim I feel we need just one name that is saleable to the public and sounds right.How about Environmental tillage or Enviro-till for short. Also we need to get some modulation cash back. Overwintered stubbles followed by a low input spring cereal will receive £125/ha from countryside stewardship is this where we could get some modulation cash. Have been to a meeting where Dr Vic Jordan was speaking and he refers to Conservation Tillage So forget my Enviro-till.We need to make a lot of noise

Jim If you get something sorted - Put my name down Clive

Sounds like a great idea. Germany and Portugal give grants towards the purchase of "conservation tillage" equipment. An association could help us to get the same. Would you be prepared to call a meeting for interested parties so that we could push this idea forward? The NFU should help and I would be pleased to do as much as possible.

Come on Jim! You started this great idea and now you have gone all quiet on the subject. I would gladly join your association and help to promote it, I think a great many people would. Where are you?

The idea sounds great, how are such organisations in other countries organised / funded, sounds like they work, use them as a basis, I guess there may be some element of public funding in other less urbanised dictatorships than "Tonys Urban Paradise"

Lets all not pay the NFU subscription and put the money into this conservation organisation as the NFU dont do anything anyway. All they want to do is get elected as a MEP so they can have there 100k a year plus all the other benefits.

Eeer-um yes! I have been amazed at the response - I must have had at least ten phone calls from interested parties not wishing to commit themselves to the internet. I think the best way to take this forward initially will be to set up a web-site (as was suggested) and try to find out what exactly people want out of a C.T Associaton. Then I would be very pleased to call a meeting. However I have got to get the politics of the job sorted as I am a director of the Soil Management Initiative and I would not want to tread on any toes there... I have studied a number of these groups in Canada, USA, France, Germany and Australia and it appears that most have a Winter meeting/conference, several farm walks in the summer and arrange specialist meetings/workshops as demand dictates. Unfortunately most rely on sponsorship of some description to operate - which would be difficult in the UK. Most groups charge farmers a subscription of about £30-50/annum and in some cases an acreage payement on top. I am very keen to get something off the ground and will keep you posted.

good luck Jim. Looking forward to your next report.

wash your mouth out with soapy water young man, I dont believe knighthoods/ peerages or rides on the EU gravy train are to be found at the end of those long NFU corridors..... are they. What ever we may think about our Union, we do need one, though I am not convinced what we have is what we need! Splitting it in two will benefit everyone exept farmers, divide and conquer , etc. Change from within, if you can be a***d to attend dull meetings wrapped in waffle and procedure, that is.

I thought the NFU is divide and not conquered but ruled over. If it split there might be two unified Unions that could reek havok.

They are all MEP wannabes. Don't care about farmers, don't understand farming at all and get paid a lot of money for doing b****r all. Get them out and put a good PR man in to advertise UK farming and then surround him with farmers from all the differing aspects of agriculture. Let us vote them on or off on a yearly basis. No more NFU subscription from me - they lost me about 12 months ago when they completey messed up the F&M in conjunction with president Blair. Idiots all of them

PR Man - my own hobbyhorse. We need to cultivate public opinion as much as wheat, poss more so. Doesn't matter what this PR person costs. I believe the NFU spends about £3million per annum on advertising. I am sure , even at London prices, half of that would buy the time of the very best, Max Clifford type I am thinking. What do you all think ?????

How about buying new Labour. Then if they are caught backing farming they will even pay you back.

Before everyone gets too excited about conservation tillage, have you read the other side of the argument in the latest Crops magazine? The Environment Agency's Richard Smith says it's the cause of run-off and compaction - not quite the view that's going to bring min till modulated cash. By the way, Jim, next time you start a thread that gets this much attention, please spell conseRvation right! [:(] Tom Allen-Stevens Arable editor, FWi

Yes Tom I have and it underlines the need for a Conservation Tillage Association, so farmers can be made aware of the problems with min-till. (I hope Crops readers turned to page 16 to Alastair Leake's comments at the Dundee conference) I have point out that the Environment Agency is promoting Conservation Tillage in its latest publication Best Farm Practices - Profiting from a Good Environment (Pages 21-32) and that The Environment Agency (Richard Smith)is one of the founder members of the Soil Management Initiative. It would also be fair to say that conservation tillage is not for everbody, if you are on the wrong soil type or your cropping programme does not suit the system for goodness sake don't do it just because others are. I am sure most of the people contributing to this forum would agree. Sorry Tom I made a spelling mistake do I have to write out CONSERVATION one hundred times? I have visions of you sitting behind a desk like an old school master viewing the forum and marking it accordingly!! - do we get an end of term report?

Yes, indeed. I expect 100 lines "I will not misspell words on the FWi forum" in my Inbox by 9:00 tomorrow. And less of your cheek, Bullock!

Peter, that's exactly what I said to our NFU group secretary 4 years ago. If the nfu had given them their advertising budget for 1 year none of the s**t we're in would ever have happened. 'Forces of conservatism' not us and we could have rubbed shoulders with the rest of the slimy b*****ds. Just think full agrimoney compensation, helpful maff/defra, controlled f+m policy, dodgy imports stopped, where do I stop?

Jim, Fully support idea for an association for conservation tillage. One of its first initiatives could be to chase some of that modulation cash!. If we are to survive at £60/tonne Wheat recreational cultivating will have to be consigned to the history books.