Just been reading David Richardson's column for the October 7 issue of FW. He was chatting to a farm manager who was worried about the lack of trained or trainable farm workers coming into the industry. Is this a nationwide problem or is it perhaps localised? 

Little wonder that kids dont want to farm now, with farmworkers living in towns, and cottages let to childless commuters , the youngsters never catch the farming bug.

The biggest number of workers in agriculture come from the county council holdings in this area, those that are left.

Those kids can drive a tractor from a young age, and do a multitude of tasks without needing trained.

If these workerless managers persuaded their bosses to let out a couple of tenancies on some of their more awkward land to young couples, their future labour problems would be solved.

Tim, Would you please ask David Richardson, the "farm manager" he was chatting to, and anyone else you can think of, what they have ever, and I mean in their whole lives, done to encourage young people to come and work for them? It is a very long time since I used to read Richardson, and heard him on TV, but he always gave the impression that he was not a person I would be inclined to have as my boss. Far too arrogant, full of himself, an empire builder already sitting on a large tract of land, and to quote one of my Australian neighbours, tended to look upon his staff as "my man" rather than give them a name. Not the way to induce people to become an employee.

Sometimes I have been in paid employment, fortunately for me in very senior positions after a few years, and I have frequently been criticised for being too easy on my staff. My normal response was that I thought slavery had been abolished.

Glasshouse makes good points. Kids that grow up in the countryside want to stay in the countryside, even if they are treated as slaves.

As a member of staff for a well known youth organisation in the countryside I am struggling to justify this kind of discussion to my membership.  I know farming needs new entrants, it's a well publicised fact.  BUT my biggest issue currently is that to get young people who are not born and bred in to the farming way of life we need to encourage them.  Over the past couple of months all I have heard is that "young people are not good enough" to work in farming.  Time is precious for all people in farming, and generally, in business but without people giving a little time and patience, and most of all trust, young people are not going to learn.  How would the older generation of farmers have felt, on starting their journey into a career in agriculture, that people in a respected position feel that they are not up to the job, and not only said in the privacy of their own farm but in the public domain for all to see and hear? I am hoping that these comments are out to provoke a reaction and may be get the young people to try and prove them wrong but I fear that it could go either way and that is the last thing we need.

I was delighted to hear that David had stood up to the initial comment at the Landskills East presentation of awards and has felt that this is fit to comment upon in his column.  I spend my days defending the young people that are working so hard to get into the agricultural industry and trying to stop them getting discouraged and giving up their dreams.  So what if it takes a bit of time? So what if things slow down a little while someone gives their knowledge gained from years of experience? If we don't give these young people a chance to learn and grow, which Young Farmers, Landskills East and all of the other fantastic organisations are doing, we won't have a future of farming.  There are the stereotypical young people who are not currently business managers and in their lack of self confidence feel the need to compare acreages and discuss kit BUT these people are the future of farming. They will, with training and support, become scientists, nutritionists, agronomists, IT specialists and all those things that the farming generation of today are now.

I must get down off my soap box as since I heard about this comment at a meeting last week I have been struggling to keep my anger under wraps.  I will finish by saying that I believe that agriculture, as with all industries, has got to embrace the younger generation.  They may not all be right for the job but we have got to give them as much support as we can to let them follow their dreams. In some cases it won't pay off but for all those that don't there will be many people who become brilliant farmers to lead our industry in years to come.  I wonder if it will be them reminiscing about this very topic in a Farmers Weekly column in years to come. Let's stop knocking them and believe in them, because I do.

 This is not entirely a young v old workers situation, in fact we have found the opposite on our farm, the older staff think they know everything and will not listen to others, but we have a 17 year old who is brilliant, so good in fact that the 40 year old is leaving by mutual consent and the 17 year old has been offered more days (both part time) to replace the older member of staff.

We found the 40 year old to be untrainable, no matter how many times he was shown how to do anything by anyone, he ignored it all.

I have met some very interesting people recently and the one comment that stood out was

'agriculture needs to understand that it is no diferent to every other industry'

I couldnt agree more.

Like any other business if you cannot attract new entrants you're not identifying their  (many) needs and fulfilling them- the offer isn't good enough.

 

I would also question how the need for new entrants was identified-

Ask the question 'do you need more staff' or 'are you worried about the lack of young entrants' the answer will be yes

 Ask the question 'can you afford more staff' ' or 'are you willing to invest in young entrants' the answer might not be quite so clear.

 

Until the govt provides a full time mentor, who will spend all his time with said young person, i will not have a youngster here.

i have enough to worry about without worrying whether a kid has managed to kill himself while no one was looking.

there are too many ways for the unwary to kill themselves or others on farms now.

Glass house

I hope you are in the minority

If your farm is unsafe  for an apprentice to work in  then you have bigger concerns than being unable to attract competent staff.

 

 

 

 

beast, there are dangers on every farm, and with the size of machinery now, and little chance of someone close by to help, so it is very easy to die.

Safety is in the mind, no matter how good or bad the equipment.

kids seem more intent on listening to ipods or texting rather than paying heed to whats happening around them.

I grew up in the country and fell in love with farming age 3, left school after GCSE's and started working for a contractor. Worked in Australia, America and N.Z, loved every minute of it! Now 28 and 5 years ago i made the decision to leave farming as i wasn't going to be able to afford a mortgage, got my class 1, now on a good wage for 40 hour week, got a house complete with wife. Miss been in the field every day, still help a friend out when he needs an extra driver. When i was 17 i nearly drove off a bridge cause i was selecting a radio station, tractor was hanging on by a mm. By the time i was 24 i'd learnt a whole lot while in America going down stone road got flat tyre on seed tank at back of planter which was bout 30-40 feet away no window open only heard it cause radio wasn't on, boss couldn't understand how i heard it let alone why i didn't listen to the radio. Rim undamaged, new tyre one happy boss. Being safe is learnt in those early years if someone hasn't had that experience on a farm then it requires more time and effort to teach them. It's down to the individual if they want to give that up. I'm thankful i had a good teacher.

For the past 15-20 years,anyone who had the inteligence to become a modern farmer was far better off financially to go and get a job which earned them the same wages as their non farming mates with less hours and less capital tied up. I have two sons desperate to carry on farming here and I do everything to encourage them as I am sure there is a future in agriculture, but so many farmers around here have lost their sons and daughters to the towns and cities and I don't know where the next generation of farmers and workers are going to come from.

The small number of young farmers around here are excellent from what I see. Perhaps Mr. Doherty's manager needs to look somewhere else for his students.

ps, beast, i have no problems with staff, i just wont hire a learner.

I started helping out on a farm where I could before I finished school, by the time I was leaving school I could fully use a tractor, putting on and taking off machinery, plough a field etc. I went to Harper and on placement was the main combine driver, relief sprayer driver and drill operator over 2800 acres. I have been an assistant manager for 3 months now and would not have this job if it wasnt for my placement. I was given a chance and didnt break anything or smash stuff up and that experience made me who I am today. Not all students are bad, most just need a chance to prove themselves.

How big is the problem of lack of trained workers in agriculture in the UK really? Here in the Netherlands we recently did a survey comparing the number of graduates in agriculture (both vocational training and college level) with the annual vacancies. The results were shocking, there was hardly any more specialised edcuation in quite a number of sectors, such as poultry, pigs, arable farming. For most sectors, the number of graduates was only 10 tot 15 % of the number of new farmers and staff needed annually. Through joint efforts of the Farmers Union and schools, we are trying to catch up and improve this situation: various training are now being done jointly by several educational institutes. This has led to an improvement in quality of education, and a (rather slow though) rise in number of students.

Are there comparable experiences in the UK trying to deal with this situation of lack of trained staff?

glasshouse:

i just wont hire a learner.

Learners have to learn somewhere. I just hope there are people out there willing to teach. For an industry that so bemoans a lack of new entrants, it does a pretty good job at turning potential starters off!

i took a school leaver on in 06, trained him up to be a good worker, then he left , last yr.

Hello.

I have just left school and trying to find work.

I have tryed the local sheep/cow/pig farms and not even one would hire me!

i have been looking for a farming job for nearly 3 years... i dont even care what it is as long as its something to do with farming....

So its all good people going round saying ''kids are not intrested'' some of us are! but we cant find any one to take us on!

 

I worked on a farm throughout my Uni course, later progressing to a full time job as a manager on a local horticultural site for 2 years. After this I spent a year on an arable farm before leaving the sector altogether.

 I paid for a lot of my own training in order to find a job and whilst I enjoyed the work in parts I ultimately left because as a career it demands far too much whilst offering comparitively little in return.

 I was unfortunate enough to work for a few farmers who were absolute $%£#'s, but regardless of that I suffered low wages, was expected to priortise the farm every weekend from Feb - late Oct, restrictions on holiday and poor working conditions. Nowdays I take home double the wage for half the hours, I haven't worked a weekend in 3 years, can take a summer holiday with my partner and I'm home relaxing by 1800 most nights.

 I guess for a young person looking at that they see poor wages, an enourmous strain on relationships and no recreation time (I couldn't enjoy my favourite pastimes of golf and cricket were I still on the farm) and its easy to draw the conclusion that no-one would want to enter the sector.

I never quite understood the attitude of the Harper students etc who seemed to be proud of working 100+ hours... my old man always said that no-one goes to their grave wishing they'd spent more time at work, and surely at that age life is for living.

 Anyway just my 2p worth and I'm sure there are people who feel differently, but I just wanted to outline why I think so few YP are interested in farming unless you come from a farming background.

bsk, if you have a degree, why were you working for a farmer?

My Dad had a few farming mates and through them I worked for Velcourt every summer vacation while at Uni. The income I got from that paid for my tuition fees, accomodation and car while there. When I graduated that experience plus my degree was enough to get me a management job at a local large horticultural concern (I mistakenly thought the future prospects were fairly bright at this company) where I spent a few years. When I decided I didn't like the people I worked for I decided to leave but was unsure of the direction I wanted to take so took a sprayer job on the village farm... sadly this turned out to be a worse option and eventually I left to join the job I have now.

people who are not brought up on farms have problems understanding  the demands of the seasons, and the need to abandon other pursuits to get the job done. especially " townie" wives

the prices paid for produce really are unchanged for 30 yrs, so paying big wages, employing rostered weekend staff is just not possible.

any tractor driver i know, who wasnt asked to work the weekend, and found someone else had been on " his" tractor, would have plenty to say to you on monday morning!

bsk , hi i dont know what job you do now or how much you earn or how many hours. all i can say as a herdsman in a responcible position im often home relaxing at just after 6pm, addmittedly a little later during calving season, i earn good money, i also have the bonous of having a very nice house on site so i dont even need to travel to work, i also have the luxury of being able to come home for all my meals with my family. i do work every other weekend but its only minimal duties. i recon to work about 70 hours in peak season n about 50ish other times. i dont know any other job that can offer anything as good

its a shame your exprience was so bad,bsk. I agree with multi-power. I live a good life as a stockman and tractor driver, nice house on the farm home for every meal, and yes when im calving or harvest work is to be done i do end up working some long hours but it makes up for it self in other ways.

And back to the original point, im from a non farming back ground bought in to it through my mechanical skills its just a shame so many people out there wont even give a second look at a youngster as i was my self when i started.I'll be eternaly greatful to the team who took me on and showed me the calving ropes!

its good to hear from two guys who appreciate what farms can offer.

there is more to life than time off and the highest pay.

no travelling saves a lot of time and expense(2nd car) and as you  say, eating  most meals with family is priceless.

trouble is a lot of farms no longer have cottages for workers, or even a farmhouse.

in this area, bankers and stockbrokers are in almost every farmhouse.

glasshouse:

there is more to life than time off and the highest pay.

very true, added to the fact that if you are a contractor or work for one, then having every weekend off and working 9-5 doesnt earn you half the money.

and there are a lot of little perks to being a farm worker, especially picking up contacts who are more than willing to help you out in times of need. for instance 9 times out of 10 (or even 99 out of 100) i know that if something breaks while im using it then i can either fix it myself or get someone to fix it for me and it will be up and running by the next morning.

I grew up on a farm but never really wanted to be a farmer, worked for a hydraulic engineers at weekends and school holidays from when I was 16, took a gap year, worked at the same place for 6 months and then went to new zealand to see some friends, landed a job as a tractor driver and have spent 20 months out here in the last three years, currently on my third visit. but for various reasons, when i get home I wont be working for anyone other than myself or my old man, not least because it seems a lot easier to set up on my own than to get a job with no real future prospects. all I want to do is to be a farmer, but even if i was to work my way up to becoming a farm manager, i would still be answering to someone.

There may be a shortage of farm workers around, but there is also a shortage of people willing to give them a chance.